FCN FTI Consulting, Inc.
$151.85
FTI Consulting, Inc. Q2 F2026 Earnings Call Transcript
Thursday, July 30, 2026
AI Conference Call Analysis
Sign in or subscribe to read.Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
and Segment EBITDA. Tech and STRATCOM both have solid quarters, particularly STRATCOM when you look at the year to date. Both of these businesses face competitive environments with tech in particular facing a very intense environment. But both businesses continue to make good progress and both see strong opportunities going forward. So what does that mean for us overall? Look, we always have As we see frequently, the chance for short-term air pockets like we've had the last few months in the UK. And of course, the world is a complicated place. And so geopolitical issues do happen like they've happened in the Middle East. And so you can have high aspirations in a given quarter based on the addition of terrific talent, which don't quite get met in that quarter. And you can have results that are affected by SG&A that happens to hit in that quarter. Those things can happen in any given quarter. But our experience is that over any multi-quarter period, the relevancy, the power of one's offering is what tends to win out. In that connection, I would note that even in the face of what I've talked about today, year-to-date, we were up 7% on the top line. and up 10% if you normalize for the econ issues we're working through, which may raise in your mind the question that we were talking about, which is how did we actually hit 10% growth, even with certain places not meeting the full breadth of our aspirations? Let me highlight two reasons, because they're important in themselves, but because both of them undergird why I, why we are so confident in this business going forward and over the medium term. One is that we continue to win in the traditional markets that we have won in for a long time, markets that continue to show themselves powerfully relevant today. And the second is that, if anything, AI is further feeding that growth. So let me take a minute on each of those. In terms of our traditional markets, the world of bankruptcy hasn't gone away, nor has the world of antitrust, of transactions. of investigations, of disputes, of litigation, of reputational issues. And what we are seeing evermore is when the stakes are high, clients want the best experts, a phenomenon that we believe has been benefiting us for seven or eight years now, and we believe will continue for a while. And our current view is that AI, if anything, is reinforcing those phenomena. At one level, we're finding that the company is involved in AI are facing and calling us for their own set of high stakes challenges, whether it's litigation, regulatory concerns, transactions, or disputes. More generally, AI itself is this type of disruptive force that tends to lead to the sorts of things that we are the lead experts at, whether it's bankruptcies, investigations, disputes, or crisis. You can talk about that conceptually. You can see some of that in the headlines. You can also start to see that vividly in our client engagements. For example, in Econ, as you may have seen, one of our new affiliates recently served as the lead expert in supporting in that high-profile OpenAI bus case, which, as you may know, was a victory for our client, OpenAI. More generally, we're being asked to advise on AI-related matters involving an intellectual property issue. or disputes around misinformation or antitrust claims involving major companies. And in tech, we're finding that the leadership position that they are creating in AI is allowing them to do types of work that I don't think even they could fathom doing a few months ago, let alone a few years ago. Sophie talks about a case recently where we had to look not at 45,000 emails in a day, or two days, but 45,000 images and videos and mobile data in an incredibly short period of time to help our client decide its litigation strategy. That wasn't possible just a few months or years ago, and the leadership position we have established in those sorts of work is helping us extend and reinforce our position as the leaders for the most complicated, expert-driven work. Those are just a couple of examples. So would I have preferred that the bottom line this quarter fully meet my expectations? Of course I would. For the reasons that you all know, but also because I'm so excited about the talent we've added around the world. We believe in the best we're making and the power of that talent. And it's frustrating anytime you have short-term factors that you feel are obscuring the success that those people are driving. And of course, more generally, I am concerned about the Middle East, not just for our business. For our people and of course for the world. Important, none of what we've talked about today leaves me any fundamentally less optimistic about the fabulous teams of experts we have assembled and are continuing to assemble. The leading positions we have created, the resulting ability we now have so many places to deliver the most critical work for our clients. The effect of that work on building our brands in the market, which in turn continues to augment our position in the virtuous group of professional services, where you deliver great work for your clients, and because great people are motivated to participate in that and do that, leads to you being able to attract and develop great people, which in turn reinforcably builds the business and shows over time it was a better platform for our people, makes a difference for our clients, and ultimately creates a business that is ever more powerful for you, our shareholders. With that, I want to turn this over to Angela, but before I actually let her talk, let me reiterate, Angela, just how happy I am that you are here. Let me tell all of you just how impressed I am how quickly she's gotten up to speed and how impressed I am in the credibility she's established so quickly within our leadership team. Angela, over to you.
Angela
Chief Financial Officer
Thank you for the welcome, Steve. Good morning, everyone. I am pleased to be here. I want to thank the entire FTI team for the warm welcome and supportive experience during my transition. Although I've only been with FTI for three months, I've had the opportunity to spend time getting to know our experts around the world. What has stood out the most to me is our collaborative culture, the exceptional quality of my colleagues, and the impactful work they deliver for our clients. As a former client of FTI, I experienced the talent and expertise that our teams bring to clients firsthand, which was a big part of what attracted me to this company. It's been especially rewarding to see the business from a different perspective and gain a deeper appreciation for the value FTI delivers and just how broad and deep our platform is, which is what makes FTI so distinctive in the market. And with that, I'll review our second quarter financial performance before discussing our balance sheet, cash flow, and guidance. Turning to our results, we delivered record second quarter revenues up 5.3% year over year, led by growth in our Corp Fin, Tech, and FLC segments. Excluding pass-through revenues, revenues increased 6.5%. Notably, as Steve said, we also saw strong sequential improvement in e-commerce. Despite the revenue growth, adjusted EBITDA declined year-over-year because of higher direct costs and SG&A expenses. Higher direct costs primarily reflected investments in our Corp Fin, FLC, and Strat Coms businesses as we continued to add senior talent and build out teams behind them. SG&A has $230.7 million compared to $202.2 million in the prior year quarter. The increase in SG&A expenses reflects higher compensation The increase in compensation was driven primarily by higher salaries and benefits, which included some one-time compensation expenses in the quarter that will not recur. The increase in T&E was primarily due to our all-SMD meeting held in April, as we did not hold a meeting last year. Higher legal expenses were primarily driven by higher litigation costs. This increase included $6.6 million of extraordinary litigation-related expenses recorded in unallocated corporate SG&A. The second quarter marked an inflection point in the company's litigation against a former employee originally filed in 2023, which fundamentally changed the scope of the litigation. In May, the court allowed a third amended complaint, which expanded the case to include additional defendants including a competing firm and new claims. Because of the magnitude, complexity and expansion of this litigation, we believe our shareholders will benefit from visibility into the true underlying operating performance of our business and transparency into the costs associated with protecting the company. Adjusted EBITDA of 104.5 million or 10.5% of revenues compared to $111.6 million or 11.8% of revenues in the prior year quarter. Adjusted EBITDA, which excludes the extraordinary litigation related expenses, declined year over year as the increase in revenues was more than offset by higher direct costs and SG&A expenses. Billable headcount increased 3.2% year over year. As Steve mentioned, we continue to find and invest in great senior talent, reflecting billable headcount growth of 5% at the SMD and MD levels, as our expert model is increasingly relevant in the market. Our Q2 effective tax rate of 20.8% compared to 22% in the prior year quarter. The decrease was primarily due to tax benefits related to a tax equity investment in renewable energy. This benefit was partially offset by an unfavorable tax adjustment for share-based compensation compared to the prior year quarter. Weighted average shares outstanding, or WASO, of 29 million shares compared to 33.6 million shares in the prior year quarter. Q2 GAAP EPS was $1.99 and adjusted EPS was $2.16. The variance between GAAP and adjusted EPS was due to the extraordinary litigation related expenses, which reduced GAAP EPS by 17 cents. Now, turning to the segment level of performance. CourtFin had another strong quarter, delivering 8.5% revenue growth year over year. CourtFin's top line performance was driven by higher realized flow rates across the business and higher success fees. In the second quarter, turnaround and restructuring represented 44%, transactions represented 26%, and transformation represented 30% of segment revenues. The transformation practice exceeded our expectations this quarter, growing 26% year-over-year as we support end-to-end cost takeout, supply chain, and operational efficiency mandates. Key industries supported in the quarter included telecommunications, technology, and healthcare. In transactions, revenues grew 10% year-over-year as we supported more key deals, such as Skyworks acquisition of Corvo and Hogan Levels merger with Cadwallader. Of note, the turnaround in restructuring saw a 2% revenue decline year-over-year. We continue to support some of the largest bankruptcies globally, including Dish Network, Beard Airlines, First Brands, and Morelli in the US, Prax Lindsay Oil Refinery in the UK, Hyzen, the largest out-of-court restructuring in Brazilian history, and in Asia, we're supporting the lenders in the restructuring of a number of well-known Chinese property developers. Importantly, we continue to make investments in Corpfin. In fact, almost 50% of our year-to-year headcount growth can be tied back to investments. Such as building out our transactions and transformation businesses in EMEA and our healthcare and mining businesses in Australia as we've added junior headcount to support investments we've made over the last two years. In SLC, our North America business continues to perform well, primarily driven by our financial services and cybersecurity businesses, where demand is being driven by shifting regulations in a more complex threat environment. As Steve said, AI is the type of disruptive force that tends to lead to demand for expert services. Our clients turn to us when AI gets complicated, risky, or broken. In financial services, clients are being challenged with how to deploy AI responsibly and are questioning whether AI tools are being used appropriately or if AI processes are creating regulatory, legal, or operational risks. In cybersecurity, the adoption of AI introduces new risks including exposing their data and AI generated content or automation contributing to fraud or misconduct among other challenges. Clients are equally concerned about the AI risk introduced by third parties and the ability of AI to enable cyber attacks. While demand for expertise is being driven in part by AI in these areas, the business overall saw lower volume due to continued pullback and regulatory enforcement. Nonetheless, Our ability to be the firm our clients call on for their most complex cases means our higher realized bill rates allowed us to deliver year-over-year top-line growth. Our market positioning is strongest where clients need independent judgment, credibility, and deep expertise. And in this vein, we also continue to make investments in senior headcount in FLC, with more than 40% of our year-over-year headcount growth being at the SMD and MD levels. As Steve mentioned, this quarter's econ performance exceeded our expectations. Econ revenues increased $13.2 million and adjusted EBITDA increased $14.7 million sequentially due to strength and compass lexicon in both EMEA and North America. In EMEA, growth was led by our M&A-related antitrust business. supported by mergers such as Anglo-American sale of its Brazilian nickel assets to Hong Kong-listed MMG, and Amadeus' plan to acquire French biometrics company Idemia Public Security, among others. In North America, growth was driven by Compass Lexicon's financial economics and antitrust businesses supported by headline cases such as the OpenAI engagement Steve mentioned. The sequential increase in the Justice Segment EBITDA was due to higher revenues and lower compensation as we had some 1Q compensation items that did not recur. TEC's 18.4% revenue growth year-over-year was driven by increased demand for M&A related second request services. As you might remember, Q2 of 2025 was an unusually slow quarter for M&A related second requests with a number of paused or canceled engagements resulting from the change in the U.S. administration. STRATCOMS also delivered a solid quarter. Excluding pass-through revenues, STRATCOMS revenues increased 5.4%, primarily due to higher demand for corporate reputation services. Worth noting, STRATCOMS results reflect the strength of our multi-year investments to build out our higher margin event-driven offering such areas as crisis, cyber, M&A and activism, including working with Corp Fin on restructuring for Wolf Speed and Spirit Airlines and the mega mergers of McCormick and Unilever and Skyworks and Corvo as well as high profile activism work such as Lululemon. Now turning to key cash flow and balance sheet items. Net cash provided by operating activities of $152.3 million compared to $55.7 million in Q2 of 2025. The increase was primarily due to higher cash collections and lower forgivable loan issuances and income tax payments, which was partially offset by higher operating expenses and compensation payments. During the quarter, we repurchased 2.6 million shares at an average price per share of $150.84, for a total cost of 390.9 million. We made those purchases based on our assessment of long-term value and available balance sheet capacity while continuing to fund investments and talent. As of June 30, 2026, approximately $344 million remained available for share repurchases under our share repurchases program. Turning to our full year 2026 guidance. Year-to-date, our revenues are up 7% year-over-year, or 10% if you exclude econ. As such, we are reaffirming our guidance for revenues of between $3.94 billion and $4.1 billion. While we're maintaining our revenue guidance, we are lowering our GAAP EPS guidance to between $870 and $930, which compares to the prior range of between $890 and $960. We expect adjusted EPS to be between $910 and $970. While the first quarter also included litigation-related expenses, the $0.40 difference between GAAP and adjusted EPS reflect our second quarter extraordinary litigation-related expenses of $0.17 and our current estimate for these expenses in the second half of the year. Our updated guidance incorporates the following key assumptions. First, econ exceeded our expectations in Q2. The sequential improvement demonstrated by our Compass Lexicon business was meaningful and broad-based. As discussed last quarter, the cost structure is already in the P&L. And while we don't expect another sequential step-up, we do expect year-over-year growth in revenue in adjusted segment EBITDA in the second half of 2026. We are an event-driven business, and therefore our results can be lumpy due to factors such as jobs rolling off and new jobs rolling on, which can be exacerbated by seasonality, as well as market activity in key areas such as restructuring, M&A, and regulatory activity. Although there are geographical differences around the world, the restructuring market has been softer year to date. Despite the weaker market backdrop, our global restructuring revenues increased 8% compared to the first half of 2025, as we continue to increase our market share, especially in large company-side matters. This is once again evidenced by our leading positions in league tables as we remain well-positioned to win the most complex matters globally. For M&A, the current U.S. administration's more deal-friendly posture has boosted mega-deal volume, driving higher demand for our second-request services in tech and M&A-related antitrust services in e-commerce. However, faster clearances, more negotiated remedies, and fewer litigated challenges may reduce the duration and intensity of our engagement. In corp, fin, and strat cons, we believe we are taking share as we continue to bring more of our services to our clients across the deal lifecycle. For FLC, which also benefits from high levels of regulatory scrutiny, we have seen slower markets under the current US administration. However, we have won our share of engagements or more on the largest, most complex cases, and our teams have been quick to pivot to support areas of revolving client needs. Third, we're differentiated by our low-leverage, expert-based model, and we continue to see strong opportunities to invest in great talent. We've announced 45 SMD and affiliate hires year-to-date in key businesses such as transactions, transformation, corporate reputation, disputes, cybersecurity, and risk and investigations. Additionally, we're poised to welcome more than 270 graduates in the third quarter as part of our annual class of hires. Fourth, we expect SG&A expenses for 2026 to be approximately $70 million higher than 2025, which compares to our previous expectation of $60 million higher. The increase is primarily due to an expectation for higher legal expenses, which include extraordinary litigation related expenses. Sequentially, we expect SG&A and Q3 to be approximately $12 million lower than Q2. Lastly, we now expect our full-year effective tax rate to be between 21% and 23%, which compares to a prior range of between 22% and 24%. Our record revenues this quarter reflect the powerful platform and the unique set of offerings that we have. as well as how relevant our people are in an increasingly complex evolving landscape. While this business experiences its shared volatility, or zigs and zags as Steve said, I am energized by the strong fundamentals supporting our long-term growth trajectory. That confidence is reinforced by a very strong balance sheet, a differentiator that's uncommon in our industry. I am excited about our opportunities ahead with the continued focus on transparent engagement with our shareholders and creating sustainable value over time. And with that, we'll open the call up for your questions.
Operator
Conference Call Operator
Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, you may press star then one on your telephone keypad. If you're using the speakerphone, we ask that you please pick up your handset before pressing the keys. To withdraw your question, please press star then two. Today's first question comes from James Yarrow at Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
James Yarrow
Analyst, Goldman Sachs
Good morning and thanks for taking the questions. Steve, I was hoping you might be able to expand a bit more on your comments around the Middle East impacts on the business. Specifically, what I think would be helpful might just be a little bit more granularity on how the geopolitical disruptions are weighing on the business in the region. And then I guess as we look ahead, could that at some point flip to a tailwind for your businesses and why?
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, look, it's a good question. Look, eventually, could it be a tailwind or a business? Of course. We believe our business is currently functioning well below the capacity of the team we have there, and it's a terrific team. The real question is, When the heck does that happen? And I think it's really, really difficult to proceed. I mean, first of all, and the manifestations of the geopolitical conflict are different, right? For some period of time, you had people exiting for fear of safety, then they came back. Sometimes some of the buyers are suspending purchases at this point in time, and then they authorize the purchases, but then they suspend the start of assignments. And this thing, you get You get reports that change weekly on a weekly basis. And of course, we get reports from our political leaders that suggest that different weekly forecasts of the end of a geopolitical conflict. So I think it's incredibly hard to forecast this. And it's not that we don't believe that there would be a long-term tailwind. My general experience over a million years now in professional services, over any extended period of time, if you have the best team, You win, because there is a need in those markets. But forecasting when is hard, and so I think we're being very cautious about saying we don't see a turn any time near term. I hope we're wrong, James. For the world, not just for us.
James Yarrow
Analyst, Goldman Sachs
Thanks, Steve. That's really helpful. Just turning quickly to restructuring, obviously robust in the quarter again. We are seeing a growing list of macro and geopolitical considerations that I would expect could impact restructuring, whether it's private credit, the global conflict, as well as software issues. Could you just give us the mark to market on what that means for the restructuring outlook from here and whether this has started to improve?
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, look, let me, I'm going to let, since my crystal ball always fails, I'm going to let Angela try out her crystal ball. But let me just agree with your more macro points. We believe the macro forces out there are incredibly favorable towards this business over the next while. We believe that the macro forces out there have been favorable to this business for the last while, and there's been a lot of liability management exercises that have postponed potential We believe the position we've created is obviously generating good results, but there's real upside. The question of when is where the crystal ball comes in. I've never been that good. Is your crystal ball better, Angela?
Angela
Chief Financial Officer
I hope so. We'll see. To echo what Steve was saying, while we wouldn't characterize the environment as a broad-based restructuring boom currently, we are seeing Deep Pockets of Activity, and we're encouraged by the quality and the size of opportunities in the market. As we've covered, even though the overall restructuring activity remains uneven and it's a little softer year to date, our global restructuring revenues grew 8% in the first year versus the prior year, and we do continue to win some of the largest and the most complex matters. So that gives us confidence in our market position to continue to win those larger cases.
James Yarrow
Analyst, Goldman Sachs
That's very clear. Just one last one for me. Just wanted to touch a little bit on the repurchase activity. You once again had strong repurchase activity in the quarter. Could you just update us on your capital deployment priorities from here if the stock price stays at this level, let's say, and maybe you could weigh that up against your appetite to add leverage from here?
Angela
Chief Financial Officer
Sure.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, sure.
Angela
Chief Financial Officer
As we've been in the past, we've always been opportunistic with our shared buybacks, and we don't have a specific purchase target, short term or long term. In 2025 and the first quarter, second quarter this year, we saw opportunities to purchase. And as Steve said in the past, when we believe the market has misunderstood or is misunderstanding or mispricing the potential of our business, we'll invest pretty heavily. So as we've seen with our buybacks in 2017 and in 2020, we've had a pretty good outcome so far. Asking about our capital allocation strategy, I think it has not changed. We'll continue. We are committed to our current Discipline Capital Allocation Strategy, which goes in the order of cash to fund operations and investments for organic growth, and then looking at M&A opportunities when available. We'll continue to repurchase shares on an opportunistic basis, or we always have the option of paying down our debt. From a leverage perspective, we did upsize our revolver this quarter, as you've seen, from $900 million to $1.5 billion. We viewed that as a position of strength and it wasn't a necessity. Just to remind you, our revolver was due to become current later this year, and when I joined it was a priority for me to get that refinanced. So when we had an opportunity to extend the maturity by five years, increase the size, all that improved economics, we thought it was a positive outcome to improve our financial position and increase flexibility. And given that we generate substantial EBITDA and free cash flow. We see that as prudent financial management as we can control the timing of our debt repayment as well.
James Yarrow
Analyst, Goldman Sachs
Very comprehensive and helpful. Thank you. Nice talking with you, James.
Operator
Conference Call Operator
Thank you. And our next question today comes from Andrew Nicholas with William Blair. Please go ahead.
Andrew Nicholas
Analyst, William Blair
I appreciate you taking my question. I wanted to first touch on some of the prepared remarks around kind of legislative changes within merger reviews. I think the DOJ recently announced some changes there to accelerate the reviews and potentially reduce information requests. So I'm wondering if you could speak a little bit more to the puts and takes on that development to economic consulting and maybe any additional color you could provide on what impact you've seen From that to date.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, look, as of now, we haven't seen any major impact of that on our business today. And, you know, we'll be monitoring this as we always monitor legislative changes. You know, these sorts of changes happen with some frequency and there are lots of other phenomena going on as well that can affect the business. But as of now, we're not seeing any major impact. Understood.
Toby Sommer
Analyst, Truist Securities
Thank you.
Andrew Nicholas
Analyst, William Blair
And then for my follow-up, just on guidance, I think in past years when you've made adjustments after the second quarter, you've narrowed the revenue range a little bit. doesn't, obviously with reaffirming the outlook this quarter, you're not doing that in 26. So can you just kind of speak to why it's a little bit wider range of second half outcomes than is typical? I suspect some of that's Middle East and Steve, you talked about just the fact that it's an event-driven business, having some variability, but wondering if there's any Anything else you could add there or make any comments on kind of segment level variability or where maybe the range of outcomes is especially wide at that level? Thank you.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, I think you've hit the nail on the head, Andrew. Look, if you think about, look, I'd love just to even think about like the UK and the Middle East, right? The Middle East, we have in there not a huge revenue recovery in the second half of the year. Hopefully, the world turns out to be better, you know, and that's a possibility. With the UK, which we talked about, we have confidence in the business. It's hard to turn around. I hope my European colleagues won't be mad at me, but it's hard to get immediate rebounds in Europe when all your clients are on vacation. And that's an exaggeration. All your clients aren't on vacation, but there's a lot of vacations in July and August. And that means if you start the summer slow, it's hard to get an immediate rebound. And then you say the rebound happens In the fall, well, when in the fall? Does it happen in the end of August for September? Does it happen in September for October? So there's a lot of uncertainty in general, and then there's more now. So we just decided it was not worth narrowing that range. I mean, we feel really well positioned, and for example, as Angela was saying, we feel really well positioned against some potential very big jobs in Corp Finch. But when do they start? Do they settle? All those sorts of things are still out there. And so we just didn't think it was prudent to narrow that range at this point, Andrew. But I think that's just reaffirming what you were surmising. Yes?
Andrew Nicholas
Analyst, William Blair
Yes. Thank you very much.
Operator
Conference Call Operator
Thank you. And our next question today comes from Toby Sommer with Truist. Please go ahead.
Toby Sommer
Analyst, Truist Securities
Thank you. I wanted to ask a question about The guidance from a back half perspective in EBITDA and for the year for EBITDA. EBITDA is down, but of course you're growing EPS mostly from share repurchase and I understand the litigation expense. What does it imply for EBITDA in the back half and And maybe what are the biggest levers for you to start growing that as we aim into next year and beyond?
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Thanks. I'll give you a quick start on that and then see if Angela wants to grab. Look, obviously, in EPS, we are benefited from way so in the second half of the year, although net interest, of course, is higher. And there are some other corporate things like We have a lot of SG&A in the first half of the year that we don't expect to recur in the second half. And the SG&A obviously shows up in EBITDA. And then some of it has to do with certain businesses doing better in the second half than the first half. So it's not all, you know, way-so types of stuff. But Angela, I don't know how much you want to elaborate beyond that.
Angela
Chief Financial Officer
Yeah. I mean, I think, you know, I think that's a great question. As Steve said, we did have some SG&E expenses in the first half of the year that we don't expect to incur in the second half, which included higher T&E in our all SMD meeting in April. We had some lower workday implementation spend and some one-time compensation items. We also noted lower legal expenses compared to the first half of the year. As we noted, we did have legal expenses also in Q1, but we'll start beginning to disclose our extraordinary litigation expenses in Q2. And we expect those costs to be lower in the second half of the year. That also is supplemented by we expect second half business performance improvement primarily driven by econ and tech. Those, along with the share of purchases, the waste bill impact, and our lower effective tax rate for the full year, we do believe we'll have a strong pickup in earnings in the second half.
Toby Sommer
Analyst, Truist Securities
Does that help, Toby? It does on the mechanical side in terms of EPS, but I was really trying to get to the EBITDA. But shifting gears, what is the, what's your expectation for, MD headcount growth. And you can pick your time frame over the next year or two, wondering what the trajectory would be either sequentially or year over year as we use that as an input to inform our models. Thanks.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, look, so let me just come back to the EBITDA thing. Look, one thing I think you've got to remember here, Toby, is we've been working through these The impact of econ on our EBITDA. So our EBITDA has, look, right, between 2017 and 2024, we were a growth, real growth company on not only on top line, but also on EBITDA, on EPS. I mean, with all the zigzags and all that sort of stuff, but we were a powerful double digit growth on everything. The last couple of years, we're making, you know, some of it work and grow, but, you know, we're working through a major impact I think what we've been trying to do is to get to a place where we can think that the drag from it is behind us. And that's where we think we are. The drag is behind us. But, you know, if you're going to look at why isn't EBITDA growing and all these other stuff, I think you just got to normalize for what impact, what kick in the teeth we've had in the econ business. which is the basis for the litigation, and then what we've done now to try to get beyond the year-on-year drag. So I think that's a helpful thing. I think your question on senior headcount growth is a great one for going forward. I think even year-to-date, I think our SMD growth year-on-year is more than 6%. It's between 6% and 7%, which is more overseas than it is in the U.S., and I think our MD is probably comparable to that. I mean, our junior headcount is growing a little bit less quickly, but we are growing that. And so we are still believing, we're still finding lots of people wanting to join us. We're finding powerful grand propositions. and we're finding good price realization when we need it. So we're expecting that to kind of show up not just in the, it's starting to show up in the top line growth as you saw this quarter, but we expect that eventually once you get through the drag that we've been working through for the last couple years to start to show up. Any given quarter can be funky, but go up in any medium term in our EBITDA lines as well as our EPS lines. Does that help, Toby?
Toby Sommer
Analyst, Truist Securities
Yeah. And then last question for me is I'd love to get your perspective on nominal bill rate increases and expectations for that as well as net realized bill rate increases. And if you could, as part of your answer, beyond just the whole firm, comment on economic consulting. That'd be great.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
I don't know if we give out the specifics. If we do, I'll let Angela do that. What I would say is that there's been a conscious focus that for a couple of years we didn't maintain or grow our rates as much as we should have in an inflationary environment, and we need to recapture that, and we have the ability to recapture that because of the size and importance of our jobs. And that is a message that the executive team embraces and we have been working on. And you see a particular success over a couple of years in FLC in a number of places, but everybody is focused on that. So I'm not sure we give out specific numbers on that, but it's something we are committed to and we believe we will continue to have progress on.
Toby Sommer
Analyst, Truist Securities
If I could just follow up on that, if you feel like you hadn't been raising rates enough, is it fair to say that over the medium term here, you might have an opportunity to grow bill rates more quickly than over the last little bit?
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Yeah, I think we've been starting to try to recapture that. I think that during the inflationary periods of like 19 to 24, we just were slow to raise our rates at the rate we should have in the last couple of years. We've started to make progress, but we expect to continue to make progress, is the way I would say it, Toby. Does that help?
Toby Sommer
Analyst, Truist Securities
Okay, thanks.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Any other questions?
Operator
Conference Call Operator
We have no further questions at this time, sir.
Steven H. Gunby
Chief Executive Officer
Well, thank you very much for your time and attention, and we hope everybody's having a great summer, and we look forward to being back with you in a few months. And welcome again, Angela. Thank you all.
Operator
Conference Call Operator
Thanks everyone, that does conclude today's conference call. We thank you all for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect your lines and have a wonderful day.